Short Mode

Diaster please explain in this thread why Short Mode is as important as you say it is.

Because so far, as I understand it it seems like a giant waste of time.

The map is slow right now, the people who play the map love rpg and don't mind spending a little time to get to power. I want to spread the map, and most people are kinda impatient, -anns takes 2 long and -nm can get boring pretty quick. with -sm games will start at a higher level and make the game playable as a pure aos. If you look at games like shinobi wars which have short mode that is almost the only thing played, because people don't wanna spend 30 minutes waiting until their character can do anything. We all know the real fun of the game is large high level battles, sm would cut the time it takes to get to that. Bosses then would be what makes the rpg unique, along with storyline. I know you may not care about spreading the map, but I'm personally getting sick of small games w/ all the same people, and I think this map is good enough to where it deserves a big crowd, larger than the crowd I'm getting off my side project map.

You could always just speed the normal EXP gain up, in both -anns and -nm.

hmmm I suppose that could work....but what should it be set to then? I mean w/ 8x it takes 2-3 hours to hit 62, maybe 10-12x?

Well, -fm does like 8x right now, so you could have -ufm (ultra fast mode) or -sfm (super fast mode) that give like 12-20x depending.

-AN does 2x
-NS does 8x

-ANNS does 10x

alright maybe 15x then, maybe we can play around w/ numbers in a few test matches.

I have no issue with toying with those numbers, I personally think -Nm and -AN is absolutely fine as is however -ANNS we can test with any numbers since whatever we choose it is balanced because everyone has the same buff's.

No..You don't need to mess around with the multiplier rate. It's fine for -an and -ns and -anns. What you need to do is make the early game not last so long, and quicken the overall pace of the early game. You do this by lowering the amount of exp needed for levels in normal mode. If -nm is faster, since it's just a multiplier for -anns and such, it'll also be faster for -anns.

-nm sucks for mage building because it's slow. Make the amount of exp you need to level 2/3 of what it is now, or make all creeps and heroes give 2/3's more exp. I think it would be easier to change the amount of exp needed though.

This fixes -nm, -an, -ns, and -anns. The game is slow. So make the slow part not last long by making it so you're only there for a while. Adding a new mode doesn't solve the problem for other modes. The fact is, most people will still play
-nm so when we host, people will still leave and never try MM&M because it was so slow. Adding a new mode doesn't help spread the map. Making the boring parts/grinding last for a lesser amount of time does fix this however.

agreed.

We can do try out the reduced exp rate, Ill look into it to see if something better can be found, however adjusting the exp rate will effect all game modes not just a specific one so this is a very touchy subject to do. I will be honest and say I wont do it this next release which should be tonight because my plate is already full with changes and fixes to tie up before the release, but this will be on my list of things to do.

I don't expect it next version, however I do expect it before code reset.

Changing the -nm exp values fixes/changes all versions. -nm is the most played and most hosted mode, so you should have the exp as a set rate for THAT mode. Realisticaly, I don't think anyone will complain that they level faster. The only thing this may really effect is the value of a low level mage compared to a high level one because they'll become stronger faster. However that point is moot as the current balancing system needs work anyway.

currently the exp rate is determined by the -Nm mode. when we say 2x or 8x or 10x its using the -NM exp rate as 1x base.

I realize. The other modes are just multipliers. So by having the normal mode have less exp, and the other modes at the same rate - it still speeds up the other modes too.

Because -nm is the most played mode, and is how the map will be spread, it should be so that mode isn't boring to play in the early stages, or atleast speed up that early stage. The other modes will follow. The easiest way to do that is to lower the value it takes to gain a level.

heres my suggestion... DO NOT lower the exp rate required to level simply make an a -qm [quest mode] where there is no war but the experience reward is like 2x or 2.5x what it normaly is which helps people get up faster.. but i think if the overal experience required is reduced in any game type it will remove the challenge of lvling in the great war... which for me is funner i dont like quick wars that you lvl extremely fast in unless its -anns... it takes away from a part of the game wich is the challenge of lvling... but if people really want to they can do quest mode...

The problem with that Demonic is that people will be playing the great war/-nm when they host. If they see how slow it is leveling, they won't give the map a chance. They won't know about -qm and what not. You could always make the early game less exp (So getting to 35 is a LOT faster) and then keeping the amount of exp from 35+ up the same.

but then that slows down anns, so either lower the global exp rate needed or increase the multiplier on anns.

ok fine... scratch my idea heres my new one...

hard mode or something... for people like ME who like the challenge of hard lvling... reduce the experience of -nm my 2/3 then for hard mode or w/e you call it make the experience rate -2x

You fail at math diaster.

If I need 200 exp to get to level 2, compared to 300 currently (Fake numbers) in normal mode, and I get 10 exp per creep, I need 20 creeps compared to 30.

If the multiplier remains the SAME.

Let's pretend 10x. I need 2 creeps to level, compared to 3 creeps to level. It's sped up by the same amount...It's a multiplier. I don't know if I explained it well, but think about it.

By reducing exp needed for -nm (and all modes) then you effecitvely speed up ALL modes. You speed up the early game mode for ALL modes.

yes but if you only speed up to 35, anns won't go as fast as say if you globally decreased exp needed, and you already tend to get to 35 in about 45 min so saving 15minutes won't do much in a 2-3 hour game.

No, I'm saying globaly reduce exp needed to level. But only up to a certain point. It doesn't have to be lowered up to 35, it doesn't have to be lowered up to a certain point at all - it can be up to 62. Just saying the exp to level up should universally be reduced by 2/3.

by 2/3 or to 2/3... by 2/3 would make it only 10 kills to lvl instead of 30 to 2/3 would make it 20 instead of 30

lol, its fun watching the two of you attack the argument from two differant angles but unknowingly your both on the same exact side

I'm pretty sure you already agreed. I could close this topic and it would still be implemented .

on the topic of a shorter mode i think we need to implement the 'victory or death' thing.

i think that all heroes of each team are teleported to the enemy base with about 2 waves each, so whoever kills the npc's faster wins it.

and why do you need to lower the global exp needed when you can just multiply exp by a bit more if its the same thing?

no need to make it more complicated

It's less complicated IMO. Increasing every single creeps, heroes, troops etc. Exp gain, in comparison to changing a global EXP needed to level up.